Lanehawk Mistake resulting in suspended pending, need advice and info

ATL · Member

Lanehawk Mistake resulting in suspended pending, need advice and info

grumpy1 · Guru

Can not say for sure but this is just my guess. There should be a record of the written verbal warning first. All the verbal's in the world means nothing if it is not written and documented. Now I am in a different local and the meat department but I do know that they can terminate you for theft on the spot and if they pursue that angle then you are screwed. Your best hope is that there is no record of a verbal documentation or timely Union notification of one should it be a case where Management is trying to create one falsely. This will probably end up going past a stage two and to what your Union rep and HR can work out but if Kroger is set on termination then you would be looking at arbitration and that can take months to get done. If an honest mistake and a good work history with no past problems then Hr and a good union rep may work out something that can save your job but not made whole. Do not count on this being done in a week or two. Also keep on your union rep and try holding their feet to the fire to get you the results you want.

ATL · Member

Thanks for your input... Recently, we have had about 3 full-time people in the front end get suspended pending... All of them got their jobs back... The dollar amounts involving these cases were all over $100+.... Mine was a mere $40 and a honest mistake... I basically f--ked up... No one to blame except me..

BTW, I did talk to my union rep. and he doesn't think anything can be done and its not looking good he says.. He said he will set up some kind of meeting next week..

Now, I have 2 weeks of paid vacation left for this year.. Can I use them while I am suspended?

-- Edited by ATL on Friday 24th of September 2010 12:47:53 AM

grumpy1 · Guru

If it does not go past a stage two then your are looking at a few weeks but more if it goes to HR , the last step before arbitration. And Kroger will not want to go to arbitration if they feel they can not win because arbitration is expensive and the loosing side pays for it. And we are talking about thousands of dollars for an arbitration hearing and decision.

barada · Guru

ATL wrote:

Thanks for your input... Recently, we have had about 3 full-time people in the front end get suspended pending... All of them got their jobs back... The dollar amounts involving these cases were all over $100+.... Mine was a mere $40 and a honest mistake... I basically f--ked up... No one to blame except me..

BTW, I did talk to my union rep. and he doesn't think anything can be done and its not looking good he says.. He said he will set up some kind of meeting next week..

Now, I have 2 weeks of paid vacation left for this year.. Can I use them while I am suspended?

-- Edited by ATL on Friday 24th of September 2010 12:47:53 AM

yeah, you can get your vacation pay, and any personal days. i did.

Iv'e been in a two month battle now, over a initail, on a log.

the union is slow, and yeah, you gotta stay on them, or they work on easier cases first.

iv'e known two people who actually , personally stole,and still got their job back so it is possible to win. but bear in ind, kroger will stall all they can, to make you give up. If you can afford it, ride it out for as long as it takes. get a another job, in the mean time, and remember, you are NOT fired, no matter what paper kroger sends you in the mail. you are still employed, as long as a greivence is still going, and you still get to use your benifits.

the wait is hell thou, beleive me, i know. but you have nothing to loose by fighting it out

ATL · Member

so, my health insurance and everything is still good? Thats good to hear at least..

I am assuming the lost wages, I will not be able to get back? Or can I collect on unemployment?

ATL · Member

I got a meet schedule on monday at my store to meet with my union rep to file the grievance paperwork

grumpy1 · Guru

ATL wrote:

so, my health insurance and everything is still good? Thats good to hear at least..

I am assuming the lost wages, I will not be able to get back? Or can I collect on unemployment?

Part of what the union will ask for is to have you made whole.
What that will meen is that you will get back pay and everything will be as if you never was off a day from this suspention. If not made whole but just brought back--- then you are screwed as you will bacicly loose a lit of seniority and need to start over.

Date: Sep 25, 2010

Don't sweat it... the progressive discipline steps need to be filed; and since you don't have one other than this one, you will more than likely be brought back on a last chance agreement. Follow these steps - 1. File a grievence right now! 2. Ask Management to produce previous write-ups to Union Official when you sit down and if your radical enough and Kroger drags it out and you want it solved NOW and If your that concerned 3. when you do sit down - bring a Labor Attorney as a surprise! Do NOT tell anyone (including Union Rep) who this person is. Once introductions are made in the Managers Office, watch everyone run for cover! They will dismiss the meeting and you'll be back before you know it.

ATL · Member

good idea.. Thanks for the tips... I already called my union rep after 2 min. i was brought upstairs and suspended.. Meeting is on Monday..

I was told by inside source they skipped 2 steps on me b/c I should of got a proper note to file, then a ca, then a 3-day suspension, and then suspended pending.. Almost feels like they were trying to get rid of me b/c I am full-time...

ATL · Member

stage 2 now.. store manager denied our request to be instated... She says it was loss prevention that made the decision and denying it.. But I dunno what to think.. So far, 5 days loss of pay :(

grumpy1 · Guru

ATL wrote:

stage 2 now.. store manager denied our request to be instated... She says it was loss prevention that made the decision and denying it.. But I dunno what to think.. So far, 5 days loss of pay :(

My bess guess is that the next level wii be your district or zone manager. If they have a good relation with the store manager you will probably be denied and it will go to the next level that is the union and HR department. From there ( if Kroger denies it) would be arbitration. But if HR looks at it and sees the company does not have all its ducks in a row, then it probably will not go to arbitration. Arbitration costs a lot of money ( last time I waS told it was about $5000 ) that the loosing side has to pay. If it goes to that piont and you need the money then look for another job and inform your local rep that you are not quitting end expect to be made whole. When it is done and you have won, then you can come back to your store with back pay and as it you never was away from there.
Just do not give up. That is what Kroger wants you to do.

Date: Sep 27, 2010

They are trying to get rid of you because you are full time(remember this incident for however long you are at Kroger when you take that Associate Insight-chaulk "strongly disagree with every question!) This is instituted by RISK, and these A-holes keep in mind don't deal with the s*&^ you do everyday.
Your Store Manager is going to refer it to the next step, as you will find Managers are not really Managers anymore, they are checklist Managers, plain and simple. If it ain;t on a checklist, your Store Manager ain't going to deal with it!
Now it's your turn to add to their woes...go file for unemployement! Of course you will be denied, but it will keep at least four H.R. people working on your situation. Don't forget to go down and file some sort of discrimination charge too for extra points. Listen to that anonomous one with the" producing previous write-ups"...that writer is correct!
Remember...now it's YOUR turn to screw with "the woman" !

ATL · Member

I never mentioned I was asian and they are all white.. ;) I have filed an EEOC charge against 1 of my other store managers before and thats when they offered me money and a transfer...

And thanks for the encouragement guys.. I am on stage 3 now.. Zone manager denied my reinstatement.. Its b/c of this new lanehawk policy supposely.. The zone manager/store manager said the value of the items lost b/c of my mistake was around $35.00. My next meeting is Oct. 26... Can't believe they are doing this to me over $35.00.. I am cashing out on my 2 vacations left for this year now.. BTW, union rep. in the stage 2 meeting didn't ask for back pay but just to be reinstated.....

Soo many people have lost way more money than me and have got their jobs back... I know I messed up and it was my fault, but I think for a $35.00 mistake, this suspended pending is way too strict as a punishment.... I would think a 1-2 week suspension without pay would be reasonable...

-- Edited by ATL on Wednesday 6th of October 2010 10:36:13 PM

ATL · Member

btw, I really love how my front-end manager tried to make me look super bad in the stage 1 meeting and didn't have my back... And that made-up warning note to file didn't help my case... In which she dated that she gave me the note to file verbally on a day that I was on jury duty.... I DIDN'T EVEN WORK THAT DAY.. Store manager acted like it was nothing and how it was just a guess of what the date was when she SUPPOSELY gave me the verbal warning.. THERE WAS NEVER A SIGNATURE from me, but where it said signature, fe bitch wrote "VERBAL." Thats some bs... I honestly don't ever wanna work for that b---th ever again....

grumpy1 · Guru

ATL wrote:

I never mentioned I was asian and they are all white.. ;) I have filed an EEOC charge against 1 of my other store managers before and thats when they offered me money and a transfer...

And thanks for the encouragement guys.. I am on stage 3 now.. Zone manager denied my reinstatement.. Its b/c of this new lanehawk policy supposely.. The zone manager/store manager said the value of the items lost b/c of my mistake was around $35.00. My next meeting is Oct. 26... Can't believe they are doing this to me over $35.00.. I am cashing out on my 2 vacations left for this year now..
BTW, union rep. in the stage 2 meeting didn't ask for back pay but just to be reinstated.....
Soo many people have lost way more money than me and have got their jobs back... I know I messed up and it was my fault, but I think for a $35.00 mistake, this suspended pending is way too strict as a punishment.... I would think a 1-2 week suspension without pay would be reasonable...

"" BTW, union rep. in the stage 2 meeting didn't ask for back pay but just to be reinstated.....""

f this is true then I would contact the international office at UFCW.org and complain. I good union rep goes into any grievance and asks for the person to be made WHOLE. If they did not do this or ask for this then they are selling you out short.

grumpy1 · Guru

ATL wrote:

btw, I really love how my front-end manager tried to make me look super bad in the stage 1 meeting and didn't have my back... And that made-up warning note to file didn't help my case... In which she dated that she gave me the note to file verbally on a day that I was on jury duty.... I DIDN'T EVEN WORK THAT DAY.. Store manager acted like it was nothing and how it was just a guess of what the date was when she SUPPOSELY gave me the verbal warning.. THERE WAS NEVER A SIGNATURE from me, but where it said signature, fe bitch wrote "VERBAL." Thats some bs... I honestly don't ever wanna work for that b---th ever again....

Was it on officail kroger disaplinary form? It still would have to be given a copy to the union. As I was always told, any write-up is not of any value or worth its time until the union is notifies of the write-up and infraction.

barada · Guru

NEVER assume ANY member of management will back you, no matter what. standing order, is all dept heads, and management will supprt each other, against a employee greivence, even if they disagree with it,. trust me, i know. a man who sang my praises long and loud for years, turned into 'he is a unreliable, undependable liabiblity"
they stick together. hmm

managemnet will produce all sorts of papper you have never seen. at my second stage, the zone manager pulled out papers over 10 years old,that i had never seenand had abosolutly nothing to do with the matter at hand.
the whole goal of managent at these meetings, is to get you to give up. give you no hope, make your case seems pointless. they don't want a fight. they already know weather or not they want you back, and nothing will change their mind. if you get your job back, it is because they are forced to.
all this, is just chest beating. nothing will be decided at such a early stage.
the real battle, is latter. IF, and its a IF, the union thinks you are being wronged, and WANT to fight for you, they will, and likely win, because kroger looses money, fighting it.
problem is, the union is lazy, and picks its battles. they like easy to win fights, that they can boast about. hard ones, they will back burner you, if you let them.
wish i could give you good news, but i myself have been fiigting for 3 months now, over a simple isue, and no end in sight..
all i can say, is fight it, you have nothing to loose, but don't get your hopes too high.

ATL · Member

Thanks again for the encouragement... I am being told now, that I won't get my vacation pay until this grievance is solved.. Well, I been out of work since Oct. 1... I really need the money, so I dunno, this really sucks!!!!!!! I got bills coming up... I was also informed by an inside source, they the Front end manager def. doesn't want me back nor does the store manager... And I would prolly be sent to a different store if I ever was to get my job back... Gotta love KROGERS.... I hope they get theirs oneday and is out of a paycheck.. People get deperate and go crazy when they f--k with their money... 2 things you don't f--k with people: Their money and family....

Like I said, I put myself into this situtation, it was my own fault, I am to blame, but I really hate how everybody is treating me on this... None of the good things I done in the past for my store even matters at this point.. Been with the company since 02...

-- Edited by ATL on Thursday 7th of October 2010 05:09:04 PM

ATL · Member

It was a "NOTE to FILE" Almost looked like a made-up write-up writtened by my bitch-ass front end manager.. I never even saw the sheet..

grumpy1 · Guru

Just remember to make sure your union rep asks for you to be made WHOLE. and if you do not want to go to another store then press the issue and let them knoiw you want to remain at the one you are at and made whole there. Then watch what you do and if they start anything , them press a grievance for harrassment or unfair working conditions than they may want to press your way.
Always remember that a union contact has no value at all if you do not use it or press the issues that are unfair. Remember this is not Wal-Mart.

Date: Oct 9, 2010

Hang tough Girl and don't give up the ship! Forgot to tell you previously that also ask the UFCW what was the discipline for others on the Lanehawk reports. I GUARANTEE you others are still working with a worst case than you! Go back down once you have the info and file another discrimination charge.
I know the bills are due but MotherKroger is going to give you a whole lotta cash before its done. The initail cash offer will be minimal; remember, there is more to be had!
I bet your Store Manager is a woman-I know you are too-but remember this-Kroger is on a quota system for Management and the breakdown is 70% women; 20% minority; and 10% of what the Division HR recruiter can hire as "working regardless of number in the five year plan". Doubt what I write? Contact your HR department and ask about the "Five Year Plan". The point is, your Store Manager undoubtedly is a part of the five year plan and doesn't have a clue. When you produce jury duty note when write-up occured, file ANOTHER discrimination suit with remediation as "Store Manager to leave store/ seek termination of Store Manager for falsifying company documents". Call the Vice President of Auditing and get G.O. involved with this as well. When you win (and you will!), Kroger will never screw with you again.
Girl...YOUR GOING TO BE RICH IN the coming months! Marry me!!!

grumpy1 · Guru

now I could be wrong here and in the meat department, I will admit to not knowing a lot of what is going on in all the other departments but here is my question or comment on this. First thing is I do not know what or any thing about this Lanehawk procedure, standard, policy or what it is so i will have to be educated on it later. I am sure there is someone out there that can explain it to a Grumpy old Meat head.

But here is what I think is going on. The company can make its own procedures and guidelines to whatever it wants to as long as it does not cross the Language of the contract. Is there problems with front end and losses? probably but not any more than any other department. Can the company change its policies and procedures if they feel they need to? Yes I would and at the same time I would do whatever it takes ( fairly) to secure my profits and reduce my losses. But if this is a standard that they want to initiate then they would have to negotiate it into the contract. We , in local 540, are dealing with that in the cutting tool during these negotiations. But that is another story.

Lets say that your division management has decides to make this policy mandatory and now it is to be a standard for all stores to follow. Your store manager will be given his/her orders and they will follow them. Your front end manager may not like it or think it is fair but they will do whatever it takes to keep their position. So what is happening is the company is trying to circumvent the contract by creating a new standard and calling it a policy so they do not have to answer to the language in the contract. Front end or department managers are often told that something is a policy and not a standard but the company will press it as a standard but when called on it will state it is a guideline or suggested policy to be used and not a standard. This has happened to me and is being addressed in our contact talks of the HR double talk.

Now here is what I think and only my opinion here. We have a person that has made an honest mistake and store management is looking at it thru the new company policy and told that it will be done this way. Now we have a sustention with a possible termination grievance here. The store manager is not going to over turn it because this is the new policy. end of step one.

Now you go to step 2 and the district office and manager. Now they are following the division KMA standards that they want implemented. They have no power to over turn this since it was directed to them from over their heads. SO on to step 3 of the grievance procedure.

This is where you will find out just how much this company and the HR staff will fight to turn a policy into a company standard and circumvent the union contract. I feel this is a toss up and if you have a union business agent that is worth their weight then it may get solved here. they will have to argue more that just a $35 mistake ( in which HR would probably give in) in that the Company is using this to change a policy into a standard and not negotiate it. If HR is stead fast on it then it will go to arbitration and this is where the battle would be fought. The issue is ----- is the company trying to set new standards ( thru policy change s ) without wanting to negotiate them ? Now if your Union Rep fails and it goes to arbitration and they loose, then this Policy will become a standard in which everyone will have to follow until it can be addressed in the next contract. If HR wins then they can start treating this as a standard and have everyone follow it because if they go to arbitration then a presidents would have been set for other cases.

Again it is just a grumpy old thought here but if you wanted to set new standards and had to negotiate them with a union that did not want to , what would you do? would you single out an individual and use a new policy to try to implement a new standard out of a grievance procedure?

Elms is a standard for management to make schedules and taught , thru classes that this is a key retailing standard to follow. But now when I questions it , HR staff told me it was not a standard but a suggested guideline to be used. I and my union rep has both heard the guideline speech while they preach to district and store level management that it is a set in store standard policy. That makes it a standard and subject to negotiations.

I see this going to a long drawn out grievance where they are wanting to set an example on this employee to circumvent the contract language and set new company standards. Just my opinion. SO hang in there and be hopeful for a big celebration at the end of the grievance procedure.

ATL · Member

yeah, i keep hearing that this lanehawk bs is very nice and my union rep has never dealt with this before... And zone managers and store managers are saying this is a new policy or etc.. Risk Management pushed me to be suspended pending? BTW, I am not a GIRL... lol

grumpy1 · Guru

ATL wrote:

yeah, i keep hearing that this lanehawk bs is very nice and my union rep has never dealt with this before... And zone managers and store managers are saying this is a new policy or etc.. Risk Management pushed me to be suspended pending?

BTW, I am not a GIRL... lol

Now if I ass-u-me d that you was or made a comment to that effect then I am sorry. Just took it for granted and did not think. But then again I am in the meat department and everyone knows that there is a big lack of intelegance in that department.

ATL · Member

no, not u, the other guy posted that i was a girl.. Just got my seperation notice and also hr letter saying that i was terminated dated 10/7/10.. where i was suspending sept. 23..

Can I collect on unemployment even if I am working another job?

grumpy1 · Guru

I do not believe you would be able to collect unemployment . Kroger will fight you on that. have herd of that happening several times where they will fight you collecting unemployment on any suspention or termination. Now if you are working under the table ( cash only pay) or only making a very small amount, then there is no harm in applying and seeing what happens

But just do not give up. Just feel tht they7 are looking for a test case on this policy and they are looking to make an example with you. Just keep your union rep informed of what you are doing and keep on top of them, the union. That is what you paid union dues for.

Just remember that you want to be made whole. Nothing less than that.

ATL · Member

i have a legit 2nd job... Not under the table and they know about it.. But it doesn't pay as much as I made at krogers b/c it was just a part time job where kroger was my full-time job.. I will go ahead and file for it and see. Nothing can harm at this point for trying.. lol

grumpy1 · Guru

ATL wrote:

i have a legit 2nd job... Not under the table and they know about it.. But it doesn't pay as much as I made at krogers b/c it was just a part time job where kroger was my full-time job.. I will go ahead and file for it and see. Nothing can harm at this point for trying.. lol

No harm in trying. If they deny it then it will give you more information on what they are thinking. Just hank in there. and remember being made whole means thaqt everything does to where you was never gone at all. Benifits, pention. seniority, pay and everything else.

Date: Oct 12, 2010

ok someone fill me in, i've worked for the company for several years and never heard of a lanehawk mistake....what is it?

ATL · Member

There is a new thing on the front end.. Sensor on the bottom of each register.. Tells you if there is something under the customer's bascart.. Now, there is faults with this system.. Sometimes it wont tell you all the items underneath.. And if you scan the item, and then the customer/bagger puts it back under the cart, it will trigger it again.. Its not 100% effective... Like, I said, there is bugs.. And when your swamped, tired, and look at long-ass lines in your register, tendency sometimes will allow you to override it thinking its nothing under there or you already scanned it and just not paying close attention b/c your trying to get the customers out the door..

Its still pretty shady the customer didn't come back to pay for her 2 cases of beer. My fault, but still!!! And my retarded bagger didn't even say anything to me..

Date: Oct 12, 2010

we have little mirrors on the bottom of the checklanes so you can look at the next checklane to see if there's anything on the cart. not a checker so idk if it works.

ATL · Member

we got that too...

ATL · Member

Meeting is Tues... I think I am done playing Mr. Nice Guy... Its time to play dirty :) I been out of work 1 month, and thats over $2k out of my pocket... I feel like my managers set me up to be terminated and its only for $30... I did not get a CA or a 3-day suspension first, but went straight to suspended pending... I got **** load of bills to pay and etc. So, I decided that I am going to file a lawsuit in small-claims court against my managers espec. the one that lied and made up the date about my warning in which help lead me to my termination. Also, thinking of bringing my lawyer into it and going to sue the company for discrimination.. Nothing seems fair in my case. :) I will bring this to all my attention at my meeting on Tues...

Before anything, I will see if I get my back-pay first and how HR is treating my case.. If they do not offer me backpay, I will give a bill of how much work I have missed and how much money is owed to me to my manager that set me up.. I will give her a chance to pay it before I sue her.. At this point, I ain't got sh-t to lose ;)

-- Edited by ATL on Sunday 24th of October 2010 01:55:00 AM

-- Edited by ATL on Sunday 24th of October 2010 01:59:41 AM

ATL · Member

update, sh-t just got real... After 3rd meeting, HR still denied my grievance..... Union rep. will get back to me on arbitration while I am getting my case together for lawsuit against some "nice" people that help lead me to the situtation with 2 month's lost pay.

I was even nice and just asked for half the pay I had lost from the suspension from HR but they still denied it. So now, I will be asking for all my lost pay and maybe more now...... They had their chance, time to stop being Mr. Nice-Guy... :0

And for the people from my store and company, yeah thats right, you know you did me wrong for making up false info that helped lead to my termination.. Thats right, I am coming after you guys, in court thats it.. Don't worry, I am all about being 100% legal here... I hope yall's pockets aint empty...

-- Edited by ATL on Tuesday 9th of November 2010 06:31:03 PM

-- Edited by ATL on Tuesday 9th of November 2010 06:31:22 PM

Date: Nov 9, 2010

See other posts concerning this...dont be pissed! Remember, "Our People are GREAT!"

Date: Nov 9, 2010

Told ya' !!! Point the direction with the law firm that others have been brought back to work with same errors and mistakes. Screw Kroger - let them prove otherwise because they can't. Now will you marry me?!?!?!?

ATL · Member

marry u? WTF are u? LOL haha

ATL · Member

anybody got bruce lucia's e-mail address?

knowledge1 · Newbie

Overriding LaneHawk is the same as sliding merchandise. "Sliding" is when you knew there was merchandise not paid for and you let it "slide" by. The system told you there was merchandise not paid for and you chose not to make sure it was scanned. This is a fireable offense and does not require any warnings or CA's before hand. They have a photo showing the merchandise not scanned, the information of the items scanned in that order and the order before and after it to insure it wasn't a lanehawk error. You have no case. You even admit to it!